I rate Keane quite highly, but i'm not sure i want him. I don't know how well he'll do being played in that position, and again we'd end up either playing Babel or Keane on the left, so we still don't have anyone with a natural left foot.

My main concern is the price though. For £20m i believe we could sign a better player, or someone we'd get many more years out of. Keane is 28 isn't he? I think £20m is a bit much for a forward of that age, especially as pace plays quite a big part in his game. His pace won't last forever.

For £20m i wouldn't be willing to buy him. Torres was only £21-£23m and he's much younger than Keane, and most would agree, much better.

I know it's becoming tiresome constantly mentioning these players, but i think Silva or Arshavin wouldn't be much more than that price.

As for Barry, he only has 1 year left on his contract, and it doesn't look like he'll be staying at Villa for long, so wouldn't we be better off waiting another year, in the hope that he'll be a free agent?

Barry picked up an injury in his first day of training ...

I reckon all of Keane, Babel, Kuyt and Benayoun will play frequently, though generally i think the first three will have most opportunity. But over the course of a match i think i'd sooner have Babel come off the bench than Kuyt, any day.

And Kuyt is a big favourite of Rafa's so i expect him to start quite often. It'll be interesting to see the team Benitez settles on come the March time, when rotation is seen less and less. It's usually a bit off from what you'd predict at the beginning of the campaign.

rumours from Germany is that Leverkusan are planning a bid of up to £3 million for Voronin!
Then again that was from the Mirror and a few german newspapers. Any fee would be welcomed from me!!!

Was it Levekusen you got him from?

Yar.

Could've sworn it was Dortmund that were in for him? Although that was only from someone elses word as well, rather than any article.

£3m for a free transfer is a profit - something we're making a lot under Benitez. I'd take it if it's needed, for our transfers to happen. And i think Benayoun could perform excellently in a more central role, playing as second striker - this would take a large portion of games Voronin would play away. Then there's the old case of one Krizstian Nemeth. Personally, i'd like, nay, love, to see him involved next season, getting appearances on the bench, but i'll admit that Benitez and his staff know the situation far better than i or any of us do, so if he needs a season on loan (wasn't he planning on going to Leeds?) then that'll do me.

With Torres, Keane, Kuyt and Babel, with Gerrard and Benayoun capable of playing as second strikers, i think we'd have sufficient cover. Especially as we must surely use only one striker for large periods of next season. In fact, i'd love Kuyt to have more opportunities in his natural, central position - when the team requires him, of course. Anyway, we could cope without Voronin.

I think it actually might be Hamberg who are interested in Voronin. £3 million would very much be welcomed from that transfer. Suprised a profit of that much would be realistic to be honest. Be a fine bit of buinsess.

I would like to see either Nemeth or Pacheco involved a little bit next season. I dont see any reason why they can not have a role to play in the Carling Cup. Be very good experience for them. Nemeth obviously holds quality above the level he is currently playing at in the reserves etc, so it would be worth while to him to either be more involved or indeed go on loan.

defo agree with your comments on Nemeth and Pacheco. They should be training witht he first team this year and playing in all the early League Cup matches at least.

Ive got VERY high hopes for Nemeth making a name for himself in the next year or two.

I think pacheco has so much talent and could go far in the game and would love to see him involved in first team action this season some time, he looks one hell of a talent Same with nemeth - with the new 7 on bench rule i think we may see more and more of these youngsters rafa is so impressed with and i think it can only benefit Liverpool fc in the long run. Rafa is buying them as he see's them as the future of LFC and i certainly hope that they work hard and fulfill this promise that they are showing - i just wish anderson and hammill was not going out on loan as i think that coming on for the last ten mins of games when we were either winning or had nothing to lose would be beneficial to their development - but rafa knows best and he has sent them on loan for more match time which i hope benefits us in the long run..

The futures bright, the futures red - You'll never walk alone

I wasnt that impressed by Pacheco i gotta say. He lacks finishing.

I also thought that Plessis is extremely overrated- hes an average reserve player and doesnt produce anything special. Dunno how he got in the first team.

Kuyt i really hope stays, hes far our best winger. babel is good and has a brigh future but i just dont think he performs to his highest standard every game- wheras Kuyt does. He runs the whole field down, goes into tackles, looks for passes for Torres, has a decent cross, sets up tons of goals and scores great goals in big games. Hes a key figure for this season no doubt about that.

What muppet said that 'Liverpool might flog Dirk Kuyt to Newcastle for £7m to raise funds for keane' in the sport section today?

Hes worth far more than £7m anyway!

Very good point about the new 7 sub rule. I think this could breath some life back into each Premier League clubs youth system and give a few youngsters the chance to gt some valuable first team experience.

In this day and age of squad systems and I wouldnt mind an increase to the number of sustitutions your allowed in a game also.

Even if they just increased it to 4 per game.

Has anyone thought if we signed Keane and Barry - how bloody good we would be at penalties?!

Barry's taken penalties for as long as i can recall at Villa.

Keane the same for Spurs.

Gerrard has taken ours regularly last season and missed only once (saved), but showed his undeniable composure with the Arsenal one in the Champions League.

Kuyt is also a superb taker, scoring both penalties versus Everton and the winner in the 05/06 CL semi-final versus Chelsea.

That's without considering Torres. (I know he's supposed to not be great at them, but he has scored penalties before and more importantly has improved significantly since joining us.)

Then with Reina in goal, the penalty-saving specialist, we would own anyone and everyone before us.

If you play Keane alongside Torres which i think you guys need to play 2 up front as last season you did lack a bit of fire power as you dont need Mascherano adn Alonso in the midfield, Javier is good enough to do the defensive work himself. Keane would be wonderfil alongside Fernando Torres, Keane is an intelligent and quality player i htink hed help Torres' game even more, at the moment its mainly Gerrard playing the balls for Torres to latch on to Robbie Keane will give you that aswell, he will drop off and pick the ball up and play good passes forwards towards Torres and the winger sthen get into a good position for a return pass and then he can get a shot off. He would be a magnificent signing for you id you play him the same way we do, although i hate to say it, he would be quality.

Midfeild and Forwards

Right Mid--Mascherano--R.Babel
--------------Gerrard--------------
----------Keane---Torres---------

Mate are you for real!?!?!?!?!?

Honestly FFS!!!

You are talking about two kids who you have seen mainly only in pre season friendly games!

They are by NO MEANS the finished article. They WILL make mistakes, Its all part of the learning process that ALL footballers go through.

I hate hearing anyone slagging off a young player even before he's been given a chance to get used to his new required level. If we adopt this attitude with all players Gerrard woul dhave been binned off, Crouch wouldnt have made it, Beckham, Giggs, whoever you name it

No player is the finished article at 19.

Very few exceptional cases STAND out above others at that age. the likes of Michael Owen or Robbie Fowler but also for every Fowler who shined at that age there is also a Kevin Gallen who dissapeared in later years.

Im not saying Plessis is gonna be world class or indeed do anything in football, same with Pacheco but to write them off based on what you see of them in a few pre season games at the age of 19 is a joke.


I can only imagine you a re young inexperienced footy fan and if thats the case fair doo's, you'll learn in time

very good post Xabi!!

TheRedsofRafa, did you not see Plessis's debut against Arsenal at the emirates last season. He was one of the best players on the field that day. He played his first competative match against experienced internationals such as Fabregas and co and very much looked the part. What do you expect him to do? What do you want a defensive midfielder to do in a match? They are there to break up play, something which he did. Players in those positions go about their business with limited fuss. It is not a position that grabs headlines, think about it. Like Xabi said, he is 19 for gods sake! And as for Pachenco, you have obviouslt made your mind up about him from one friendly. You have obviously not seen reserve and youth matches were he has been fantastic. He boasts a lot to his Arsenal. He has superb vision and has a great touch. Finishing will come, he is only young. Give him time to develop before you slag them off.

thats a posibility Yobbo but what is more likely is this

.......................TORRES
KEANE..................................KUYT/BABEL
.............BARRY..........GERRARD
...................MACHERANO

Keane and Kuyt would not be used as conventional wingers, they are more like wide forwards, like how United employ Rooney, ronaldo and Tevez. Maybe a 4,3,3 if you like. The wing backs will be used to explore the wide areas and give us width.

Two problems i have with us playing two up front are:

i) If we're going to spend around £18m on Gareth Barry, he is going to play. He has to. Likewise with Mascherano

ii) We're too weak in wide positions. Neither Benayoun, Babel or Kuyt i think are suited to playing in a 4-man midfield, as side-midfielders if you like. The latter two are striker's and thrive in the more advanced wide role, and Benayoun to me performs best playing off the striker or attacking midfield. We'd arguably need to spend money on two new wide players if we were wanting to challenge for the title in that formation, and it's money we don't have.

I also think 4-2-3-1 suited us a lot. We only changed to it late-February, and after which we enjoyed many wins and a great number of goals. Gerrard can't effectively play with Mascherano in my opinion as neither are great passers - they're not made for playing possession football, not like Barry or Alonso. Having all three in midfield gives you a bit of everything - Mascherano's grit and defensive ability, Barry/Alonso's passing ability and Gerrard's attacking mentality and incisive passing. It also gives our full-backs more license and, as said, suits the style of our 'wingers'. Finally, there is the argument that Torres performs better playing as a lone striker. Of course, we tend to do better towards the end of the season anyway, but i do think the formation played its part.

What i would agree with is that we don't need Mascherano or Alonso, or rather, don't need them so deep. Having both does take away a striker position in a sense, but it also allows Gerrard and the two wide players to play more advanced, sort of in-between midfield and attack. What i think though is that be it Alonso, Barry or Lucas they should be given far more license to get forward, alongside Gerrard. Two defensive midfielders is too defensive, but all those "defensive" midfielders we've used have the ability to be influential going forward, and we should allow that to happen. I'd love to see Barry and Gerrard playing more alongside each other next season, driving the team forward, with Mascherano (who can also drive forward) sitting behind and mopping up.

Personally i'd set us up something like this, as i said a page back:


----------------------------- Reina -----------------------------

---- Arbeloa ----- Carragher ----- Agger ----- Dossena ---

-------------------------- Mascherano ------------------------

-------------------- Gerrard ------- Barry -------------------

------- Kuyt ------------------------------------ Keane -------
---------------------------- Torres -----------------------------


With Keane and Kuyt's intelligence and very clever movement, work rate and also natural ability in the penalty area (and instinct to make those direct runs), put alongside Torres' obvious threat, that trio could be extremely difficult to defend against - more than people may first imagine. They'll both play quite centrally in a way, dropping off a little but also getting into the box - doing either when appropriate - and the width will come from our two full-backs. That's why i don't think we really need anyone with a "natural left-foot" as Sticky says. The two 'wide' players aren't going to be running the line looking to get crosses in all match - that won't be their main objective. Dossena and either Degen or Arbeloa would overlap down the flank and provide that option. Also, our balance is exceptional as it is, with left-footers Barry and Agger in the team (should Barry sign, i'll add).

With the immense drive in the middle of the field, coming in no small part from Gerrard and Barry's combination, along with all just said, i think the system could prove quite impressive.

I'm actually really excited about the prospect of Barry and Keane signing. Although i should try to temper that a little as both signings will be accompanied by a mighty struggle, i foresee. Especially the Barry one because it surely must hinge on Alonso.

The thing i like about Plessis is how composed and assured he looks. He just trots around the pitch and turns up in the right place to stop the opponent's play, then returns the ball to someone else for the attack to begin again - and hardly ever loses the ball, at that. Nerves don't seem to affect him, that much we saw agaisnt Arsenal (and in every performance he makes).

Pacheco is 17, which is all i can say. Nemeth took the reserve league by storm, but has 2 years on the Spaniard - i'd put a little bet on Pacheco being more successful than the Hungarian if i'm honest. I've been very impressed by Pacheco's football intelligence for someone so young.

Its just a pity Nemeth is away with Hungary this summer otherwise we could have seen him making a big impact this pre-season also