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Young Pro
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That foul shouldn't have been given, so technically speaking the game should have ended 1-1, but Di Natale's goal should have counted and Ferguson's shouldn't have, so in fact it's Italy who should be complaining because the ref almost cost them the game.
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World Class
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Poor ol' Scotland. They deserve to be in the European championships so much more than us.
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Moderator
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Poor ol' Scotland!?!? They had their chance, their destiny was in their own hands, and they screwed it up. Tough titty. So the goal was a bad refereeing decision, so was the decision to rule the second legitimate Italian goal offside. I agree we don't deserve to be there Sticks, but our destiny is on our hands so more the fool us if we mess it up again (which under McLaren wouldn't be a surprise to be honest) |
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Young Pro
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Bad loser McLeish.
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Grass Roots
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England are not yet in EURO,if they lose to Croats,but since the croats already qualified...most probably they won't lose
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Moderator
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That is it, it woud be typical we mess it up after such an amazing result in Israel tonight! |
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Current Member of The Year
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whining jock.
he is in no position to complain about the referee |
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Senior Pro
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You can't compare the two. The free-kick was incomprehensible by any possible figment.. the goal was much closer. The goal is one of those that sometimes get given and sometimes don't. It may well be the right result with all decisions weighed up, but any idiot can see why he'd feel aggrieved. |
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Current Member of The Year
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once again, thats b*llocks mate. the goal was perfectly clear. no confusion was involved, nothing was blocking the linesman's view and the decision was embarrasing and so clearly a goal. not even 50/50 like you claim. if the rightful goal counted it would have been 2-0 and game over anyway. its a case of swings and roundabouts. the poor decision directly cost Italy a goal. the poor defending cost scotland that goal. |
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Senior Pro
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It wasn't clear at all, it was very tight. Tighter than i thought after rewatching it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81BSiYb_LfU
Yes he may well have been a fraction off-side, but it's close. The Italy free kick was a free kick to Scotland! So my point remains that you can't compare the two incidents. |
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Senior Pro
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I'll be honest and admit that I would have liked Scotland to have qualified, so long as England did too. They've done brilliantly to come so far in their tough group, and just fell agonisingly short.
But this referee baiting on the part of the jocks, including Mcleish and McFadden's post match comments, is absolutely PATHETIC. Laughable even. So the referee gave the Italians a free kick near the end. It was equivalent to a corner, nothing more. It wasn't like the he gave them a penalty was it? And the jocks still had an excellent opportunity to defend it. What about Di Natale's perfectly legitimate goal in the first half? That would have been 2-0 and game over right there and then. And Ferguson's goal was blatantly offside; the linesman had a perfect view but somehow failed to give it. These are two massive decisions - goal awarding decisions - both that went against the visitors. So all this bullsh!t from the Scots is pure sour grapes. Bad losers, and deserved losers. They defended badly for both goals and got punished. That's why they lost. Not because of the referee. I feel strongly about this because if we English were making excuses like that (which to be fair we probably have done in the past) then everyone else would be slaughtering us, so to hear the jocks serve up this crap highly amuses me |
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Senior Pro
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There were three players in the way of him seeing when the ball was struck. |
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Current Member of The Year
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besides that do you not agree with what he is saying?
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Senior Pro
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Look at that youtube clip on about 58 seconds. When the shot is struck, you count how many players there were between Ferguson and the linsman. Zilch. And that's what the linesman should have been watching - Ferguson's position. It's clear that a shot at goal was taken, hence he should have been seeing who was in an offside position on the rebound. Ferguson is clearly offside from the moment McCulloch took the shot to Ferguson's finish. How is this a close call? |
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Young Pro
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scots complaining about referee is just ridiculous. they should congrat the italians and be proud of what they did in this very tough group. this meaningless complain only takes away some of the bright of their great campaign. anyway, even if it ended 1-1 Italy will beat Far Oer and France get at least a draw against an unmotivated Ukraine, and Scotland will be out
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Senior Pro
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I've stopped the video at the exact (or as close to exact as i could get) moment that the ball is struck (determined by the movement of the Scotish players leg):
As you can see, the linesman is obstructed by 3 players, and remembering that Ferguson and the defenders are in motion (hence getting the position wrong is quite easy, since he can't see the exact moment the ball is struck) - this combined with the speed at which all this is happening and the fact he gets just one glance at it. Yes, i think it is a close one. Hardly clear cut! Not in comparison to the other decision (which is what i was on about in the first place). |
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Grass Roots
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Look, referees and assistents can make mistakes, they often do. I was just stating that it's no sense people would moan about referee after assistents gave 2 gifts to Scotland. Isn't it clear ? |
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Grass Roots
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First of all can I say, as a Scotsman, that I was quite embarrassed by the comments of McLeish, McFadden and Hutton moaning at the end of the game. In the heat of the moment, you say things straight from the heart, however it would have been more appropriate to have congratulated France and Italy on progressing.
It was sickening watching the game. I've never felt so numb after watching a football match. However now that time has passed, I feel I have a more philosophical approach. The refereeing was shocking, however things did even out. Like Italy's goal that was ruled offside (but was clearly on) was a decision in Scotland's favour, as was our equalising goal (which was offside). However the controversial last-minute free kick certainly went Italy's way, as did the handball in the box decision. 4 bad refereeing decisions granted, yet I can't help but think that they had as many bad calls as we did. And with regards to people saying that Scotland 'deserved to win'. The team who scored the more goals deserved to win. Plain and simple. Hard to take but it's true. I mean, France totally outplayed us twice and lost twice, did they deserve to win? There are many if's and but's, however in the end, unfortunately only points won counts. Big Eck summed it up best: "We needed to be super human to win. But in the end, we were only super." |
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Admin
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it was very hard on Scotland the way the match ended , obviously a shocking decision by the ref to give Italy a free kick which led to the winner for Italy and eliminated Scotland from Euro 2008 . They should have defended the free kick better ...last minute ....vital to stay focused ...all that hard work gone in a few seconds .
Italy did have a perfectly good goal dissalowed and Scotland had a legitimate claim for a penalty possibly for that handball incident , the Scotland equaliser was marginally offside (according to Match of the Day`s computer analysis) , i think Mcleish is understandably upset about the last minute exit , however he must remember that Scotland did concede in the first few minutes which gave them a mountain to climb . In the end they can only blame themselves for the poor results they got during the campaign ... |
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Moderator
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A good, honest post there Andrew. |
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Grass Roots
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Good post and i agree with you with everything apart the handball which wasn't a penalty. For the rest, a true fair play supporter, congrats |
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Senior Pro
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This is a very minor debate but I’ll say these two things: 1. From the linesman's angle, he has a perfectly clear view of Ferguson, who is the "key" player in all of this. The linesman should be focussing on his position as he's the last man, and whether he plays an active role in the move. 2. From the moment McCulloch strikes the shot to the moment when the ball hits the net, Ferguson is offside. It’s not like he moves from onside to offside or vice versa. For these two reasons I think that it was a clear offside. Certainly not “touch and go”. |
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Moderator
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Just to point out about the offside that a study in the Science journal | ||||||||||||