I could be, but I'll never know. I'm currently working with some excellent footballers in my own team at u15s. Every week they are watched by pro clubs, and play against teams with many ex academy players and potential future pro's. I would like to work in an academy/CoE, but the players will only be marginally better - and it will add to my coaching experience, but perhaps not enhance it.
Maybe if I pass L3 this year a window may open.

Colin - are you changing the arguement AGAIN??? Teachers cannot run league clubs because, hang on, full time bloody job man!

In this day and age teachers who work full time could possibly not work as a manager for a professional football team. But they could easy work for an amateur team.

Course you dont need to be a good player to be a good coach.

"You don't have to be a good player to be a good coach. You DO have to be a good player to become a top coach is what you are saying, and I agree". says ian

Again i disagree. The likes of Sir Alex he was an ok player same as Sven and Arsene.

"Sir Alex he was an OK player"

1957-1960 Queens Park 32 games and 11 goals
1960–1964 St Johnstone 37 games 19 goals
1964–1967 Dunfermline Athletic 88 games and 66 goals
1967–1969 Rangers 41 games and 25 goals
1969–1973 Falkirk 106 games and 37 goals
1973–1974 Ayr United 24 games and 9 goals
Careet totals: 327 games 167 goals.

Only an OK player?!

For small teams? bar Rangers

All jokes aside, I'm sure there aren't many that have such a fantastic goalscoring record in Scottish football. I think anyone that becomes a professional footballer has to have something, and to be a pro at the top level in Scotland (when it was apparently stronger back then too) makes him a top player of the time. I know Manchester United desperately tried to sign him at the time aswell, so he mustn't of been bad.

Think of all those that try to make it as a professional. If you can make a full time career out of it then you have got to have been more than an OK player in my book.

Ian forget the teacher example its over your head and I,m losing the will to live trying to uplift your understanding.
Why are we getting side lined with Ferguson.His playing career which was just above ordinary meant that he had insights in to the game that other non players don,t get.
Even if he had played for Ossett Town he would still be a better coach than someone who hadn,t played at any level

As a player he won 0. Got close and Man United did not want him as a player nottingham forest did

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Ferguson#Playing_career

You don't seem to often look at the big picture G Man!

Would you say Alan Shearer was a good player? I don't think he has a bulging trophy cabinet.

Do you know for a fact Man U didn't want him? Wikipedia dosen't give the answer to everything! According to his autobiography (granted, a biased view) and according to Matt Busby he tried many times to bring Ferguson to Old Trafford.

Ian - playing career just above ordinary?! It's a VERY subjective game (one of the games plus points) but I cannot believe he was just above ordinary with a record like that.

Shearer only won the league for Blackburn on his own. Who were they then? Shearer made them win that league.

And shearer played at top football. Ferguson played in scotland. Enough said

OK I'm struggling to open your eyes if you aren't going to be slightly open minded without instantly dismissing my points.

I disagree regarding Shearer winning Blackburn the title for sure. And I think Ferguson was (granted, I haven't seen him play) a top player. Just try to think of how many thousands and millions of us have not made it as a professional footballer. Those that make it to Premier League, or even to SPL level must surely be above average. Is there no merit in my point at all?

Fair play your trying. Would Blackburn of won the league without shearer? i dont think so

No, but I don't think that's the same thing as him winning them the league single handedly.

Gentlemen the argument of a player being classed as good or average is as has already being stated rather subjective and lends itself to a ceratian bias revolving around personal feelings as opposed to facts. Case in point Owen is heading towards being crowned as englands record goalscorer, a fact that shall be noted in the history books, but will he be remembered as englands best striker - i doubt it very much.

We have been attempting to argue for and against the conception that one needs to be a good footballer to be a good coach. An argument further complicated with the addition of posts suggesting that it is not necessary to be a good footballer to be able to coach, but to be a good coach you need to have been a good footballer and to be a top coach you need to have been a top footballer.

Consider this my friends. In modern football in this country the facts would suggest that the better, more high profile, successful player you were then the less successful you will be attempting to manage at the same level to which you played. Steve Bruce, Bryan Robson, Roy Keane, Kevin Keegan, Id even include Garreth Southgate. There are obvously more and thats taking into consideration that success is relative.

I would also suggest that you take a trawl through the divisions and let me know when you find a manager that hasnt played professional football. Then and only then could any sort of parrallels be formed regarding being a good player to be a good coach. I am not 100% certain but close enough to state that in our 4 professional divisions there is only 1 manager or assistant manager that hasnt played professsional football at sometime even if it was just reserve team.

So my friends the only real conclusions that can be drwan from that are that 1. It is highly unlikely (i was tempted to say impossible) that unless you have played professional then you wont get a chance to manage professionally at any level. 2. The bigger name you have or had in the game the bigger the job that you will get and keep getting regardless of success - a la Bryan Robson.

92 league clubs with 91 managers and 92 assistant managers who all played professional football. I say 91 managers because it would appear that Avram Grant did not play professional football - Maybe Israel have a fairer system.

You have to have played to be able to coach
However history shows great players rarely make great coaches but all great coaches have played at a reasonable level.I classify semi pro as reasonable

A true enough statement with regards to great coaches. However here is a more appropriate statement which rather throws up a catch 22. Unless you have played professionally you will not be given the opportunity to manage professionally therefore will never know if indeed it is possible to be good at it.

yes in the main that is true unless you know somebody.The pro,s in the game look after each other.Google call it the spiral effect -Appoint people who don,t threaten or challenge you,they do the same,eventually you all fail and everyone gets sacked.In football its the "good lad" syndrome.
Thats why David Moyes was clever in appointing Allan Irvine he appointed a better coach than he was and thats why they have consistently punched above their weight. I,m not an Everton fan by the way.
But that wasn,t the main thread - the thread was do you have to be a good footballer to coach

The obvious answer to the question is no, you don't have to be a good player to coach, although in saying that the ability to domonstrate the basic skills is a pre requisite for any coach.

The problem is, that with the availabilty of coaching courses, any fool and his dog can get a small piece of paper for several hours and call themselves a coach. the fact that they call themselves a coach doesn't mean their good at it. it is well recognised that between the ages of 6-11 most kids should have the core skills of football, yet far too often i have seen teams where players can't even pass a ball properly, can't explain how to take a throw in properly and so on.

Yet in the same breath, these very teams have players that have amazing ball skills that would benefit from proper coaching, by a coach that can not only use the same rhetoric each week, but can also analyse a players game and help the player improve all aspects of his game...

in my time, i have dealt with some good coaches and have come to see their work first hand, i have also listened to coaches at the end of a game, and wondered exactly what game they actually coach...

The best coaches are those that can recognise their own weakness's and can work with other coaches to help the children get the best coaching possible. yet far too often, i've seen guys try to bluff their way through a training session rather than admit that they don't have all the answers.

Some of the courses that are available are well worth trying, yet on the whole the best way to learn is to work with seasoned pro's and listen to their advice, i done my first two badges and thought i knew it all, until i spent two years with a pro manager and coach as an observer....after the two years i realised that i knew nothing....and that was after spending 25 years playing...

Pundit
at last somebody who understands the reality in the UK -you make some really good points.A.s I,ve been saying in previous topics the FA coaching scheme does not produce the coaches we need.Its about pieces of paper not practical coaching

Fa coaching nothing to do with scottish coaching so lets make that clear. If your gonna mention the uk then you must mention the sfa.

gman
are you saying scottish football is healthy.When have Scotland won anything.Thats a direct result of your coaching system.Take off the blinkers