Liverpool vs. Chelsea

For the fourth time in consecutive season's fate has presented a European double-header between English titans Liverpool and Chelsea, beginning with the Anfield tie on Tuesday 22nd April. It promises to be a nerve-wrenching 180 minutes of football, emotionally arduous, pitting the supreme footballing nous of strategist Rafael Benitez, the Alpha and Omega, together with his inconspicuous yet mercilessly unrelenting Israeli counterpart Avram Grant in this epic - each partaking player knowing an errorless performance is the minimal requisite for progression; each partaking player knowing that the time for sherkers to become deserters is nigh, that this particular Semi-Final will curtail the hopes of the craven, in a purest's battle of absolute mentality, passion, experience and ability, where sanguine mortals will soon be divided into the faction of either 'hero' or 'villain'!

Ah, who am i kidding, just check the scores on Teletext afterwards. If anyone's managed to score, that is.

Yeah, will most likely be dull again, but it would be interesting to see Chelsea win the trophy just to see if they keep Grant after winning it.

A totally different outcome to the dull game that has mentioned.

There is alot more at stake than just three points this time around. Both team's will be all out to get an advantage in the second leg and progress through to the final. Anfield isn't the best place to go in this competition, especially if you wear the blue of Chelsea. There as been lot's and er lot's of controversy over the years between the two clubs at the latter stage of the competetion, L'pool getting the better each time.

I think L'pool are best performers of the competition at the minute ahead of Man United. The games against Arsenal were an excellent display, especially at Anfield. With L'pool at home in the first leg and if Chelsea can get at least a draw their then I think that The Blues are in with a chance this year. Chelsea have a magnificent record at home in the league and if they can bring L'pool back to the Bridge on even terms then I think this might just be Chelsea's year to get revenge over The Reds.

If Chelsea don't come away with a draw I can't see them coming back into it. They're lack of determination in the Fenerbache ties shown that they were quite happy to sit back and defend. Chelsea although they have done well to reach this far are the least greatest performers of the competition.

My prediction a Man Utd v L'pool final.

in my oppinion benitez will run tactical rings around average cant.... I am really hoping for Liverpool v Man United, imagine that atmosphere! Torres v ronaldo, gerrard v scholes, carra v ferdinand, its all there, 3-3, 5-5 aet, and a nice tense penalty shootout at the end would do quite nicely

I think you are being very generous with your praise for the scousers Leo. I would disagree. They were very fortunate to qualify from the group stages after a very shaky start. In contrast, United have been the form team throughout the group stages, were in total control against Lyon, and completely outplayed Roma at their own game. I too would love a Man Utd v Liverpool final

We weren't lucky to qualify from the group stages - we made it hard for ourselves but proceeded to score 16 times in three games, warranting progression in my mind - whilst in the knockout phase United have played no-one in comparison to our Inter Milan and Arsenal ties. I wouldn’t say you deserve the title of “form team”, not in Europe anyway.



Well, tension fuels the excitement from my perspective, but i can easily fathom what sort of a borefest the neutral fan could be treated to. In 6 Champions League meetings between the sides there's been a mere 3 goals, one of which didn't go in (although i feel obliged to remind people, for arguments sake, that we would have had a penalty had it not crossed the line); that said, i don't think Chelsea are as strong defensively, nor we, and neither are they fortified in the ways of team unity, with half their players looking disinterested. Hopefully it should be more open.

The interesting thing about this particular tie is that unlike the pair of semi-finals played prior, the final leg will be at Stamford Bridge. I'm not too bothered about going there, as it's not exactly a fortress by any stretch of the figment, with at least a draw very possible - but it does mean that we have to resolve a large part of the tie in the first leg. If we can win 2-0 we're through in my opinion; if we can win 1-0 we should at least force extra-time; if we draw then we have to score away from home... I'm not envisaging a home defeat, as i can't see it happening (although if it did, i'd predict we'd be sent out).

We've met 3 times this season and on not one occasion did i feel Chelsea were overly dangerous or an unbearable threat. The first game right at the beginning of the season should have quite comfortably been three points to us, with only that crazy penalty decision giving them hope of salvaging anything. That was under Mourinho with the vast majority of their squad fit, the likes of Drogba anyway. The second was in the Carling Cup where, despite them having players such as Lampard on the pitch compared to our side without our three best players of Gerrard, Torres and Mascherano, they only managed to beat us owing to a hugely deflected shot and then from a moment of true madness via Crouch, earning himself a red card. The third and final appearance between either side, at Chelsea's ground, harboured not a single goal and was a wholly disappointing and boring game. Yet, without Torres, we still had the best chances and really Crouch should have won it for us.

I'm not scared of them at all. I was slightly fearful of getting out of our group after our rocky start, i was definitely fearful of playing the unbeaten Italian giants Inter Milan with the second leg at the San Siro and i was terrified of playing an Arsenal side that has had a habit of ripping us apart in past Premier League games. Chelsea i am not fearful of. At no stage of the season have they been mesmerising, or dare i say it even impressive, and i'm adamant that they're only in the semi-finals because they've failed to be drawn against anybody of note. That's why i think we'll go out. It'd be bloody typical - defeated by a Grant-led Chelsea after past feats versus Mourinho.

I'm desperate to beat them as i would hate to have to choose between cheering on Chelsea or Manchester United in the final (not a certainty, but a real possibility). Only time will tell though.

Fortunate? We pretty much destroyed those three teams the second time around. More resilient than fortunate, actually.

Good response to the points made Ben. I agree, Liverpool have had much tougher games than United in the knock out phase and have done really well to get through. I was convinced that Liverpool were in such a poor position in the group phase that they were definitely out, but Lady Luck seemed to be favouring Rafa yet again. In my opinion, Liverpool carried the luck against Inter with the dubious sendings off, and again against Arsenal with the dubious penalty decisions going their way. I believe it's impossible for that run of luck to continue all the way through to winning the final, and maybe Chelsea will get ALL the good fortune this time around.

I would be truly amazed if Chelsea managed to knock out Liverpool.

I understand the "second leg at home" advantage but I reckon Liverpool will take a clean sheet minimum to the Bridge and secure a score draw. That's my early analysis of it anyway.

Why is that Jo? Is it because Liverpool are a better side than Chelsea......or is it more a 'voodoo/jinx' situation that Liverpool carry on their side in this competition?

Liverpool 1- 1 Chelsea

Got a feeling Chelsea will be in the final.

Hope am right

Hate Chelsea with a passion but I can see them finally 'doing' Liverpool. 0-0 away then a 2-1 win at home

Ben91's obiter dicta are so rife with ignorance, erroneous information, and poorly conceived notions of denominationalism that I hardly know where to begin. Even disregarding obvious errors like his insistence that those who disagree with him should be cast into the outer darkness, should be shunned, should starve, the fallacies of his claims are glaring to those of us who have educated ourselves about the implications of tribalism. In the text that follows, I don't intend to recount all of the damage caused by his lamebrained, slatternly contrivances but I do want to point out that the poisonous wine of paternalism had been distilled long before he entered the scene. Ben91 is merely the agent decanting the poisonous fluid from its bottle into the jug that is world humanity. Okay, that was a facetious statement. This one is not: He uses highfalutin terms like "pseudolamellibranchiate" and "uncontrovertibleness" to conceal his plans to reconstitute society on the basis of arrested development and envious malevolence. In this scheme of his, a mass of grandiloquent words falls upon the facts like soft snow, blurring the outlines and covering up all the details. We become unable to see that Ben91 exhibits an air of superiority. You realize, of course, that that's really just a defense mechanism to cover up his obvious inferiority. The bottom line is that Ben91 hides behind the carefully managed prevarication that the purpose of life is self-gratification.

Do you think that Chelsea could win and go to the final ? it's the third semi final they played against Liverpool and the 4th since 2004 but here the first leg will be played at Anfield.

In every way shape and form this should be Liverpool's trip to the final and on paper, it should once again be our trophy. Bold claim? Out of all the teams left, no combination of team, manager and players has more experience in Europe than Liverpool. When it comes to the premiership, the reason we struggle are threefold.

First off, we don't have enough experience and influence of players who have won the League. Rafa I believe is addressing this though. Mascherano is a league winner, as is Skrtel, Agger and Aurelio. Mascherano has been a revelation at Liverpool and one of our most reliable performers, Skrtel has adapted very quickly as did Agger and Aurelio is a player favoured by Benitez and in my opinion rightly so. Which brings me on to my next point:

Consistency. Liverpool simply do not have enough consistent performers to mount a serious title challenge. Skrtel has been a fantastic signing and will only get better and the mental strength he has shown to settle so quickly at Liverpool at such a difficult time shows me that the lad is a winner. In Agger's case injury has robbed him of his chance to continue in the same vein as that which he started and Aurelio is in a similar position. Mascherano has been affected by neither of these and as such has been a perfect addition to our squad.

Finally we come to the last main point as to why Liverpool have struggled to mount a challenge this Season. Rotation? No. Board Room politics? No. Zonal Marking? No. Belief? Yes. Obviously belief is intrinsically linked to experience and consistency. If you have experience you are more likely to believe in yourself and this belief will attribute to your consistency. If you have all three then you are set.

So why is this relevant to the Champions League? Well put simply, Liverpool have all three. As I pointed out already, we have the most experienced squad left in the competition when it comes to this stage of the competition, we have the belief due to this fact and we have a consistency in recent years that is unmatched by anyone in the competition.

What does all of the above tell us then? Liverpool v Man United final.

Of course, anything can happen and I am not for a second saying that this will definetly be the case, just that perhaps the bookies have once again overlooked the form team in Europe over recent years in favour of flair football and big names who perform in the League.

It is easy to be swayed by big names like A.C Milan, Real Madrid and Barcelona but seemingly Liverpool's european history is overlooked constantly when assessing games of this magnitude, and i'm not talking about the 70's and the 80's anymore.

A very good post Wtebar but it is heavy with bias towards your team without the support of FACTS.

FACT 1 - Experience

Current Squad

Appearances in European Competition

Manchester United 1027 games
Liverpool 859 games

Managers

Sir Alex Ferguson
Club: Manchester United
Appointed: 06/ 11/ 1986
Date of Birth: 31/ 12/ 1941
Previous Clubs: Aberdeen
St Mirren
East Stirlingshire
Honours:
Manchester United
2005-06 Barclays Premiership runners-up
League Cup Winners

2003-04 FA Cup Winners

2002-03 Barclaycard Premiership Champions
League Cup runners-up

2000-01 FA Carling Premiership Champions

1999-00 FA Carling Premiership Champions

1998-99 UEFA Champions League Winners
FA Carling Premiership Champions
FA Cup Winners

1997-98 FA Carling Premiership runners-up

1996-97 FA Carling Premiership Champions

1995-96 FA Carling Premiership Champions
FA Cup Winners

1994-95 FA Cup runners-up
FA Carling Premiership runners-up

1993-94 FA Carling Premiership Champions
FA Cup Winners

1992-93 FA Carling Premiership Champions

1991-92 Division One runners-up
League Cup Winners

1990-91 European Cup Winners Cup Winners

1989-90 FA Cup Winners

Aberdeen
1985-86 Scottish Cup Winners
Scottish League Cup winners

1984-85 Scottish Premier League Champions

1983-84 Scottish Cup Winners
Scottish Premier League Champions

1982-83 European Cup Winners Cup Winners
Scottish Cup Winners

1981-82 Scottish Cup Winners

1979-80 Scottish Premier League Champions

Rafael Benitez
Club: Liverpool
Appointed: 16/ 06/ 2004
Date of Birth: 04/ 04/ 1960
Previous Clubs: Valencia CF
Tenerife
Extremadura
Osasuna
Vallodolid
Honours:
Liverpool
2005-06 FA Cup Winners

2004-05 European Cup Winners

Valencia CF
2003-04 UEFA Cup Winners
Spanish Primera Liga winners

2000-01 Spanish Primera Liga winners

FACT 2 - Consistency

European Rankings For Period 1998 to 2007

1st - Manchester United, 2nd Real Madrid, 3rd Bayern Munich and Liverpool not placed

European Performance (For Members Of Current Squads)

Year Man Utd Liverpool
2007 SF Final
2006 R1 R2
2005 R2 Winner
2004 R2 -
2003 QF R2
2002 QF QF
2001 QF R2
2000 QF -
1999 Winner -
1998 QF -
1997 QF -
1996 - -
1995 R1 -
1994 R2 -

Recent Form In Europe

Team P W D L F A GD PTS
MU 10 8 2 0 18 5 +13 26
LI 10 6 2 2 26 8 +18 20

FACT 3 - Belief

There is a fine line between BELIEF and DELUSION. Please don't believe your own press. You are deluding yourself if you believe your combined squad/mangaer have the most experience, and are more consistent than any other team. The FACTS prove you are wrong.

Oh yes and I forgot to mention the CURRENT European rankings.

1st Manchester United
2nd Chelsea
3rd Sevilla FC

I'm sure we have had this out before but here we go again.

United may well have more appearances in european competition but of the players in their squad and ours NOW we have more experience THROUGHOUT our squad. We have made 3 Semi Finals in 4 years. Some of the players that did so are still in our squad. Some have two under their belt and some one. Very few have none, now compare that with United.

Not sure why you are posting about Premier League titles and Scottish Cups as if they matter in Europe. Benitez has been to 2 finals in the last 3 Seasons and 3 Semi Finals in the last 4. He also of course as you point out won the competition and won the UEFA Cup the year before. Benitez in his short time at Liverpool has already matched the achievement of Ferguson in europe.

Not sure where you got this garbage that Liverpool are unplaced in co-efficients, if we were unplaced we would be unseeded.

Why did you take "since 99" was that not a bit convenient. The last time you were above us in the UEFA team ranking list was 2003.

The current rankings are:

1 AC Milan Ita 31.6200 26.0675 27.9360 17.3000 102.923
2 Liverpool Eng 30.1385 17.7610 29.4860 25.4450 102.830
3 FC Barcelona Esp 17.1040 34.1620 20.2700 28.5375 100.073
4 Sevilla Esp 16.1040 30.1620 31.2700 20.5375 98.073
5 Chelsea Eng 25.1385 17.7610 28.4860 25.4450 96.830
6 Arsenal Eng 19.1385 31.7610 18.4860 23.4450 92.830
7 Manchester United Eng 17.1385 12.7610 27.4860 29.4450 86.830

I made it pretty clear that by recent I mate the last few years. This Season's form means nothing really because we are where we need to be. People forget but we actually lost to Graz AK at Anfield (1-0 Tokic pearler) and we were not that great in the group stages either losing to Olympiacos and Monaco and drawing with Deportivo but what mattered was that we hit form at the right time.

Belief. Not sure where you get your "facts" from but if you think United are ranked above Liverpool in Europe and not only that but Liverpool don't make the list, then it is you that is deluded.

Let's play a fun game shall we, you post all the United players up to this date that have played in European Cup Finals and Semi Finals and I will post all the Liverpool players.