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Thread: EFL Cup 4th Round-2016/17

  1. #11
    United 1 - 0 City

    Shots on goal - 2

  2. #12
    Seems like the constant media scrutiny and the owners are really doing a job on the fanbase.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/spo...-came-gay.html

    I would wager that every club in football has around 8% of fans that are homophobic, what a complete fucking non story. It just adds to the fact the owners are intent on driving this agenda to (as Steely affirmed ) socially cleanse at the expense of denigrating the fanbase
    Last edited by redpelt; 27-10-2016 at 07:35 PM.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Seamus View Post
    United 1 - 0 City

    Shots on goal - 2
    I was unfortunate to watch the Manc derby on Wednesday night and it was a very poor match.
    On another day Utd's goal could have been ruled out as there was 2 fouls before Juan Mata fired the ball in.

    Last seasons League cup winners City obviously didn't want to win this cup again as they only sent out their reserve side
    No shots on target also!
    Thats 6 matches without a win now for the so called Messiah Pep Guardiola.

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    what c*ck takes an eight year old girl into the away end of a West Ham v Chelsea night game?
    Haven't you answered your own question already Steely?

    the conflicts within are entirely down to the migration procedure headed up by the ever fragrant Ms Brady. at the Boleyn Ground the Trev Brooking upper was the family stand. this was where you'd go with kids or if you had delicate ears.
    to add onto this, the club introduced a new band on the halfway line which has no concession seats. this means that all those that had half way line seats in the West stand at the BG have been forced to move and all the concession seats (kids, elderly) have been dispersed again.
    Right, so families have been put in with the "shed boys" rather than being allocated a family friendly area, so how is it the parent's fault? He shouldn't dream of taking a child to West Ham vs Chelsea because getting struck by coins should be expected, it comes with the territory? Rubbish sir, this is sport not a new version of gladiatorial combat between the fans, the worst thing an eight year old should be exposed to sitting anywhere in a football stadium is some fruity language, not physical violence ffs.
    As I say, you want to brawl with opposition fans? Fine, take it elsewhere not at the ground. Nobody should feel physically threatened at a football stadium, regardless of age or gender, I do hope you'd agree with that, and if not I'd interested to hear your rationale for favouring violence between fans at a game.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    Again, look at that flyer. I have no idea how many people this was supposedly sent around to but I'd wager this is the only one in existence.

    the wording is clearly written by somebody no older than 15 and the 'lyrics' are an abomination. never in my life have I heard anyone sing anything remotely close to that so it is essentially some words on a bit of paper written by a child. the author spells Dimitri wrong on it and also uses the old club badge ffs.

    it would come as no surprise to me if this were a hoax. it certainly isn't relatable to any form of West Ham that I know. the very notion of a 'song sheet', let alone one that looks like that, is enough to get anyone handing them out some very stern words at the very least. I'm not buying it. Anecdotally I've not heard of a single person who has seen one of these, other than in the media.
    I don't buy it either fella, or the kid who allegedly got pelted with the entire contents of someone's piggy bank and was seemingly afforded the time by her father to collect the said projectiles from the floor whilst said melee ensued. Bad parenting or one kid missing from stage school ?

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    what? you have been to plenty of football matches. read what you've written again and spot your error. No? ok i'll spell it out.
    Ah right, for some reason I thought they were home fans, no of course no family areas at away grounds but the principle remains the same, you should not fear or experience physical violence when you go to an away ground.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    all very progressive and fluffy but simply not based in any form of reality.
    What is this? Every time I speak up for civilisation you want to paint me as the bleeding heart liberal PC hippy? Not supporting violence at a football ground hardly is hardly "fluffy", just common civility fella, it is SPORT - an entertainment - not some tribal struggle between two rival civilisations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    Yes, he should be wiser than to take an eight year old to that game. not because 'getting struck by coins should be expected' but because it was a high risk fixture. who in their right mind puts their eight year old child in a group of 5,000 likely p*ssed up blokes in a high risk and volatile situation?
    I'd think twice taking a small child to an away match, because you have to stand, and as you say there will be a lot of drunken blokes shouting and singing obscenities, but would I expect physical harm to come to him or her? No chance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    I said it before and i'll say it again. I'd lay money on this bloke being a plant. he was photographed inside the stadium during the game with his clearly non-distressed daughter holding out coins that he claims were lobbed at him. he then amazingly managed to find a camera after the game to talk to not just any reporter but somebody from the Victoria Derbyshire Show no less. you'd have to ask yourself what the Victoria Derbyshire show were doing at a football match and then consider the incredible fortune for them to bump into this chap where he could spin his yarn. this camera magnet has since popped up all over the news and yet curiously hasn't given his name but has given his daughter's name.
    Speculation and suspicions mate, I'd want to see better evidence than that. To be honest I'd rather it did turn out to be a set-up, as throwing coins is a really cowardly and dick headish thing to do, whoever is doing the throwing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    all this over the top dramatization about some blokes basically shouting at each other and slinging a few bits of shrapnel. i find it pathetic. but then we, as a society, are absolutely desperate to be both outraged and offended by everything.
    At the risk of sounding like your mum, a thrown coin could have somebody's eye out. Regardless of the age of the victim, I'd say it is pretty fucking outrageous if people get pelted with coins at a football match.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    people 'shouldn't' feel physically threatened but feeling of threat is a perception. football support is partisan, emotions run high, alcohol, coke etc is often involved, generations old animosity exists. to put a child into that situation in full possession of this knowledge and then complain after the event yields zero sympathy from me. it's idiocy.
    I answered that one, no sympathy for somebody who doesn't want a child to listen to a bunch of pissed up football fans singing and shouting offensive language, but for a child to be at risk of physical harm? No chance, dont care about how intense the rivalry might be.
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    I've attended most top flight grounds in this country and have been 'victim' to all sorts of threatening and intimidating behaviour as an away supporter. that's life. when we play spurs on 19 November would you recommend I take my four year old daughter to the game as an away supporter? answer that honestly.
    Not a four year old girl, because of the language and two hours of standing, but if you did would I expect her to be safe from harm inside or outside the ground? Absolutely.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    Who IS supporting violence?

    as you well know, football clubs have existed specifically out of the tribal element of supporters. the geographical location of team names is not coincidence. they are territorial by nature and this breeds fierce protectionism both inside and outside of sport. to deny that in modern football is to deny the roots of the sport. to suggest that the action on the pitch is nothing more than entertainment is something that I will not agree with.
    Well that is where you and I depart company, it absolutely IS entertainment, in a personal or professional sense I wouldn't favour one man or woman over another because they happen to support Spurs, it has nothing to do with real life. I judge every individual on his or her personal merits, as I strongly suspect you do. A dick head is a dick head, whether he/she happens to be wearing a Tottenham shirt or a West Ham shirt. As for the geographical thing, well let's be honest that has as much relevance to the supporters as it does to the players on the pitch. How many men on the pitch wearing claret come from East London these days?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    It's not about expecting harm, its about managing and weighing up the risk of it happening. the chances are increased in that environment as you well know. why on earth would you put a child in a position of potential harm? it is stupid and negligent.
    I disagree, we have moved on from the 1970s/1980s when expecting an increased risk of violence (including the risk of children getting hurt) should be on the agenda. If there are idiots who want to perpetuate that culture of violence in 2016, fine let the clubs/police identify them and stop them from attending games in the future. That's the way to go isn't it? You are not suggesting someone who thinks throwing a coin or dropping a bottle of piss on someone should be allowed to keep attending?


    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post

    certainly, the second the very first coin landed anywhere near her I'd be taking her out of there without hesitation. what prat sticks around for another 7 to allegedy head her way?meanwhile: http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/spor...villa-12100835

    I wonder if that camera magnet took his daughter there as well. after all, who'd have expected that to happen?
    Dunno and don't care mate. Regardless of age or gender if you enter a football stadium in the UK in the 21st century you should be entering a safe environment. If it isn't safe the club should be punished harshly, even if that means they play their home games behind closed doors. Fair comment or not?

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    Obviously you wouldn't in a personal and professional sense. but when a match is being played that is suspended for a brief period. I'm not talking about cracking skulls, I'm just talking about togetherness, belonging and coming together for a common cause against a common foe.

    if the reason people went to football matches was 'entertainment' the stands would be near empty all over the world.

    just the one regular properly local player for us, our captain. does that mean you cant respect and embrace the roots and ties the football club has with the area? it isn't my intention but I may come across as patronising here (so I apologise in advance) but could our diversion at this point be because of the fact I was born and grew up a mile from the Boleyn Ground coming from several generations who also were born and grew up within throwing distance of the ground?

    I don't know of your link to Tottenham as a club or an area but I suspect it is negligible at most.
    We wont agree on this, as I see "togetherness" during a match, the singing and the banter to be part of the entertainment. I usually go through a rollercoaster of emotions during a game, I shout and swear, and make the same unreasonable demands every football fan makes. However, I never get violent because I'm bright enough to realise that like the players on the pitch, we are part of the spectacle, a bit like actors in a play, but when full time comes it is back to reality.

    You are right, I've never lived in Tottenham, it is a family thing though as my old mum grew up there. However, it obviously doesn't bar me from being passionate about the club, and even if I had been born and grew up in Tottenham it wouldn't incline me towards ever thinking that fighting with opposition fans is acceptable, it isn't, it is bone headed.




    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    No thanks. I'm not going to put my daughter in the way of potential harm on the basis that the clubs/police might identify any culprits after the event. prevention is better than cure.

    it doesn't matter what should and shouldn't 'be on the agenda'. the fact is the risk is there and this is an unavoidable fact. the risk is so much lower as a home fan and at non-risk away games so there are plenty of options to take your little cherub should you wish.

    of course I'm not saying they shouldn't be banned. I'm saying I will not risk my children being the recipient of a bottle of p*ss or a coin. I could look at the away fixture list and pick out the games in which the risk of such an event is high, and therefore I would not take her. your own club is one of them, by the way.

    I would not be idiotic enough to put her in that environment and then whinge when something like that happens.
    Again, I disagree, football grounds have changed for the better as far as I'm concerned. No longer largely filled with beered up young men, looking for trouble, they are far more family friendly places now as they should be. Much progress has been made, and no doubt there is still a way to go, but just "accepting" that there is "risk" going to a particular away fixture means things are not likely to change. TBH the best reason for not taking a small child to an away fixture is the exposure to the drunken boorish fans wearing the same colour shirt as you, not because you fear attack from the opposition fans. I wouldn't take a small child for that reason, the language and the drunkenness are not what you want a kid to think of as the norm. However fear of physical assault? No chance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Hill View Post
    Nope, not fair. playing behind closed doors is an extreme and i've not yet seen anything extreme enough to warrant such a draconian measure.

    football stadiums generally are safe. however there are times and places where the risk is greater than usual. failing to acknowledge that is just ridiculous.
    A scuffle or two, handbags at ten paces, is one thing but if fans of a club think they can intimidate and attack on anything like an organised basis I'd be in favour of making that club play behind closed doors to make them get their house in order. It can be done, it has been done in England as far as I'm concerned, I go all over watching Tottenham and I've never been attacked or feared attack. Kicking, punching, or throwing missiles at someone because they happen to be wearing the wrong colour shirt is a pretty 'draconian' measure as well mate.

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